[QuadList] Question of the week-RCA AE 6000 editor/TEP
David Crosthwait
david at dcvideo.com
Tue Mar 8 09:07:55 CST 2011
Gary,
We used to lay a 15 hz. frame pulse on time code black tape to aid in color framing in NTSC land.
Regarding the TEP:
David
On Mar 8, 2011, at 6:43 AM, Gary Adams wrote:
> The TR-70 and earlier models did not have a real color frame detector. I think you could record a special 4 field (and maybe 8 field) pulse on the control track which could be used to reliably lock to the house reference. (Am I right about this or am I missing something? ) You could see the flickering pulse next to the frame pulse on the control track. That would work for both record and playback decks, but you had to record this pulse initially in order to use it. You would still have to do a test edit to get the phase right. I’m not positive about this but I have seen this mode on several models. The TR-600 had a real color frame detector and would actually detect the phase of the input video with respect to the tape demod and lock accordingly. When enabled, the deck would lock. Detect, and bump a frame if necessary. If you were not particularly close to RS-170A, you could get caught in the middle and bumping would continue.
>
> From: quadlist-bounces at quadvideotapegroup.com [mailto:quadlist-bounces at quadvideotapegroup.com] On Behalf Of David Crosthwait
> Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2011 9:30 AM
> To: videovault at sky.com; Quad List
> Subject: Re: [QuadList] Question of the week-RCA AE 6000 editor/TEP
>
> Guy and Trevor,
>
> Then I stand corrected. At the time I was working with TR 70's, I never saw the unit that Guy posted (thanks for the clarification by Chris Hill!). Just the RCA programmers were the editor controlling the 70's in Burbank during my tenure. Was the TEP smart enough to force color framing during pre-roll? That's what took so long on the RCA programmers, which was time code based (10 second on record).
>
> <image001.png>
>
> David
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mar 8, 2011, at 6:15 AM, Trevor Brown wrote:
>
>
> Guy
> That’s what our TEP looked like
> I knew it was silver not black and you had to remember to switch it to standby after the edit or it would stop the record when the counters were full (10mins)
> I think it was the first time I had seen wire wrap construction
> Not a bad bit of kit just a bit slow by modern standards
> Two machine only no external events
> Just simple programmable cuts
>
> TrevorB
> UK member
>
>
> From: quadlist-bounces at quadvideotapegroup.com [mailto:quadlist-bounces at quadvideotapegroup.com] On Behalf Of Guy Spiller
> Sent: 08 March 2011 14:06
> To: quadlist at quadvideotapegroup.com
> Subject: Re: [QuadList] Question of the week-RCA AE 6000 editor/TEP
>
> Here is a TEP.<image001.jpg>
>
> On 3/7/2011 5:50 PM, Chill315 at aol.com wrote:
> This is not the TEP. That had thumb wheels only.
>
> This is actually a programmer that was made by ECCO for RCA. It consisted of a number of parts.
> The top display was an auxiliary display panel.
>
> The Unit Programmer is the middle unit that is a couple of rack units.
>
> The bottom was a transport control panel.
>
> It was possibly a system that was first used on Laugh In. Can someone confirm that?
>
> Chris Hill
>
> In a message dated 3/7/2011 5:31:14 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, david at dcvideo.com writes:
>
>
> Hello Trevor,
>
> Thanks for the insight and the confirmation of similar problems with the TR 600's. At least I can say now "It wasn't just me".
>
> In regard to the TEP, here are two shots (for those who have no idea what we are talking about):
>
> <image002.jpg><image003.jpg>
>
> The TEP actually worked pretty well with the TR-70's. However, it was a 10 second pre-roll on the record VTR and five seconds on the source. Edit 2 and 3 at NBC Burbank had TEPs.
>
> David
> www.dcvideo.com
>
>
>
> On Mar 7, 2011, at 9:08 AM, Trevor Brown wrote:
>
>
>
> Ted thanks for the heavy weight credit
>
> We had one three machine edit suite with equipped with TR600’s
> If the crew leader had asked, do you want to go and try and get the TR600’s to lock up
> or go see the nurse she needs to stick pins in someone’s eyes I might have opted for the nurse
>
> Like a lot of things the AE 600 was a good idea with poor implementation
> It used an 8080 micro (big step up from RCA’s TEP is anyone remembers it “Tape Editing Programmer”)
>
> Machines had to be pulled into sync, but unlike previous systems that used TSO to speed up or slow down the capstan
> and create major servo disturbances
>
>
> The AE 600 reprogrammed a counter chain in the capstan servo
> This was I think 4.3. 4 in pixlock and either 4.4.4 or 3.4.3 to speed the tape up or slow it down (cannot remember the original numbers or what they were counting)
> So the lock to station sync slipped one way or the other without major servo disturbances, and so station lock was a quick recovery process after time pulling the time codes into the correct sync
>
> It was a poor lockup system and frequently failed
>
> Worst was the non standard logic to drive it, it was complex with a mix needing the third machine to stagger start
> Numerous keystrokes and only an external event to drive the mixer, so if the preview was OK you had to remember to reset the mixer or it would toggle the wrong way on the print
>
> Add to that a ¼ tape deck (again external event fired) to lift audio and mix it across the edit which again needed re cueing after a preview
> and the operating alone could make grown men cry, before machine lock up problems.
>
> Easy to look at the director and ask is that what you wanted, it was so long ago when you explained I have forgotten
> and if you did like the P/V can I repeat it, I never smiled like the guys in the picture
>
> Trevor B
> UK Member
>
> From: quadlist-bounces at quadvideotapegroup.com [mailto:quadlist-bounces at quadvideotapegroup.com] On Behalf Of Ted Langdell
> Sent: 07 March 2011 15:54
> To: Quad List
> Subject: Re: [QuadList] Question of the week-RCA AE 6000 editor
>
> Here's a shot of what looks very much like a version of the AE-6000 in an RCA trade show booth:
> http://www.oldradio.com/archives/hardware/TV/rca-tr600.jpg
>
> Perhaps someone on the list remembers this particular booth?
>
> Or the people in that shot or this one:
> http://www.oldradio.com/archives/hardware/TV/rca-tr600(nab77).jpg
>
> The guy in the blue suit and glasses could be the person sitting in the director's chair at the editor console.
>
> Ted
>
> On Mar 7, 2011, at 7:36 AM, David Crosthwait wrote:
>
>
>
>
> The answer is the
>
> RCA AE 6000 "Automatic Computerized Editing" devise.
>
> "A new sophisticated editing system providing optimum simplicity and efficiency to enhance creative expression". (I've had some "creative expressions" when editing with TR-600A's which cannot be printed here).
>
> <RCA AE 6000 bro1x.jpeg><RCA AE 6000 bro2x.jpeg><RCA AE 6000 bro3x.jpeg><RCA AE 6000 keyboard1.jpg><RCA AE 6000 screen1.jpg><RCA AE 6000x1.jpg><RCA AE 6000 bro4x.jpg>
>
> I do not know if this product ever came out, but certainly from what I can tell by pulling brochures from the DC Video file cabinet is that I picked up this printed material in 1978 or so and it appeared to be a real product. But I never heard of any implementation. Perhaps the heavy weights here on the list i.e. Gary Adams, John Turner, Don Norwood, Chris Hill, Trevor Brown and others who were associated with RCA gear (perhaps the recipient of a sales pitch or two) could elaborate. If 1978 is an accurate time period for this product to be marketed, then I think we have to keep in mind what the competition was then i.e. Ampex ACE, CMX 340, ISC, Mach 1, and perhaps some others that I've failed to mention. If one looks at the CRT display here, it's a bit convoluted compared to the industry standard at the time (in my opinion), that being the CMX 340. So perhaps the RCA AE 6000 was a little too late to come to market.
>
> I once worked with a woman who had just come from a religious network editing facility who had four TR-600A's tied to (I think) a CMX edit system, and she swore by them.
>
> There were four 600As tied to a CMX 340 (no AE-6000) in edit five at NBC Burbank, and those machines would move tape very fast, even dual edit record under CMX control. However, they were not very reliable in other aspects. That edit room had been originally projected to have four AVR-3's, but an "upper level decision" placed the 600A's in that project instead.
>
> One last note: The brochure mentions that this editor has a "switcher control system designed to interface with any 1600 series Grass Valley E-MEM equipped switcher" (did not scan that page yet but can if someone wants to see it). I can't recall RCA ever mentioning another major manufacturer in a brochure, although I could be dead wrong. Perhaps this was a no brainer as RCA was (?) totally out of the switcher business by then.
>
> David Crosthwait
> DC Video
> 2" quad transfers and more...
> www.dcvideo.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Not seen this before, but I'd say it's an RCA multi-machine edit controller circa 1983-86.
>
> Perhaps a product that didn't make it into any facilities before the door was shut and Nipper's doghouse closed.
>
> Ted
>
>
>
> Looks like a "super-duper" CMX type editing device for the TR-600 or above RCA quads. BIG floppy drives to hold edit info (reminds me of the 4100 Chyron's). Buttons and panels very similiar to the TR-600 edit system at Olympic Broadcasting Studio in Chicago mid to late 70's. Machines had come from Montreal Olympics, no 2 quite alike, what complete DOGS. Thankfully the truck had HS-100!
>
> Pat
>
> Good stumper.
>
> It looks like it was done by either CDL or Telemation.
>
> The 5 inch disc drives give it a time frame of the 70's or early 80's.
>
> It has to be after the original CMX as the unit has some features that were enhancements.
>
> Have no idea other than that.
>
> Chris Hill
> _________________
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mar 4, 2011, at 9:33 AM, Trevor Brown wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Looks like an RCA AE600 edit panel
> You can clearly see the gold key as in 66 gold key 6 (Change Pal Phase)
> There should be a Blue key too (edit replay)
> Picture is a little burnt out to identify
>
> Don't remember the 5 1/4 discs or the comments key board
>
> TrevorB
> UK member
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: quadlist-bounces at quadvideotapegroup.com
> [mailto:quadlist-bounces at quadvideotapegroup.com] On Behalf Of David
> Crosthwait
> Sent: 04 March 2011 15:59
> To: Quad List
> Subject: Re: [QuadList] Question of the week
>
> Here is a photo from the file cabinet.
> The questions for the contest are:
> What is it?
> What is the model number?
> Did anyone ever see one in action other than on the showroom floor?
> Was it a product that was "Dead On Arrival"?
>
> Other documentation will be posted about what this is (or was supposed to
> be) once the questions have been answered.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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